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97xr400r

Hey 2 smoke guys, what's the bike to get?

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The smallest lightest bike ive had was my 400. Ive been trying to ignore the idea of getting a light weight truck-it-out moto to ride singletrack and nasty desert tracks but it keeps cumming up. 

I would like to have a bike that is very close to 200lbs and blows smoke-rings. Also would like to slap a South Dakota plate on it to be able to link trails without hassle .

I think i'm looking for excessive power, wide ratio transmission and 6+ hour range. 

Is a 300 the bike to get or are there other great options, would I be happy with a 250?  I'm talking used bikes, i'd love to go get a new 300tpi but I'm pretty sure i'd regret it once i saw it tumbling down a cliff.

 

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Ask someone to let you take a spin on their 300 and after that I bet you will have your answer.  They are good bikes, the newer ones with the counter balancer are even better.  A plate would put the icing on the cake.  
 

You heard it here first!

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Finding a nice two stroke will be easy.  All late model two stroke cross country bikes are very nice, with electric start and some even have oil injection....but getting one registered with out of state tags will probably not happen.  The laws surrounding this have closed all the loop holes, making it darned near impossible.

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Ktm 300!! On my 2nd and gonna upgrade later this year if bikes will be available. Having said that my 2017 ktm 450xcf is on paper same weight as 300 but feels 25lb heavier while riding but gets me 90% of what my 300 could do. A  setup ktm 350 is hard to beat also for the average sized guy and can get a car plate

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I've seen something used but clean sitting outside ECC the last couple of times I've been in there (within the last week) that might fit your bill.  Had one of those big fat funny looking pipes coming out of the front so pretty sure it will blow smoke rings :)

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Brad Spaugh ( on a child rearing hiatus ) went all to way to a KTM 150 for the total Bushwacker Bike.  The smallest bike with full size wheels.

      👀

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👂

Are there any years in particular that seem to have a better than average reputation. I like the simplicity of carburetors? 

My only 2 stroke experience was a kdx 220 up in big bear. I rode it for 5-10 minutes and haven't been able shake the mountain bike feel of it and usable powerband. Maybe it was just the huge contrast from jumping off my 950 to that haha.

Oh wait, I also rode Katos cr80 and was super impressed with that too. Maybe that 150 would be it... I just don't have the experience with these bikes to know. 

I'm a bit apprehensive to jump on your bike Dan. I really appreciate the offer...sounds like there might be no going though. I might have to take you up on the offer 🤯

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Little bikes are a blast.  I ride a WR 125, and it is as much fun as my 300, but turns even easier.

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The 300 is light enough, yet also had enough “grunt” that you can kind of lug it like a four stroke.  Almost magical, in my opinion.  The electric start is really nice as well.  

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FYI ready to race my Husky TX300 weighs in at 242 on pro grade scale,  stock tank, only with essential needed bling, TMD skid plate, shark fin, flexxbars, extra weight unsprung from Mousses so give or take 10Lbs total for tubes. so best about 230 without some of my addons (flexxbars are heavy a couple pounds for them as well) TX300  C/B shafted Carburated linkage bike. KTM PDS bike are 5 or so pounds lighter still), removed oem lead battery for Li batt to lose another 3 Lbs.

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‘17+ 300 for sure. Counterbalance makes a world of difference, especially if you’re trying to ride 6+ hours. I have a plate on mine (Texan and military) but really only use it once or twice a year to ride Big Bear. I avoid pavement like the plague. Just need it to connect trails. 

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I have a 2001 YZ 250 that's built for the track. The entire bike (motor top + bottom, suspension, controls, plastics, seat, everything) was rebuilt about 8 (engine) hours ago. 

I had the chance to ride it back-to-back with a 2020 Husky 300 with fuel and oil injection last weekend. The bikes are world's apart. 

The new 300 has a MUCH smoother power delivery, and almost didn't feel like a 2 stroke with the lack of a wild, surging powerband. It had plenty of power for sure...it was just a lot more linear. It rode well in lower RPMs and everything about it just felt...lovely. Plus the injection runs it nice and lean so you don't spit oil everywhere.

I still love my 250 for laps at Fox, but I'll never look at it the same way out in the open desert.

If you want a plate, I think your best option is likely an older (already plated?) out of state 250 that's been tuned for trails. Brian mentioned above a 350 EXC, which is the direction I would go if I really needed a plate and wanted something as light as possible. Maybe you can find a used one and throw a Vortex box (or similar) on it to really wind it out.

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any late model 250/300 2T is a great platform as a do all machine. The YZ250 is also a great platform to work from as well.

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I am going to bump this.  I just sold my race bike and my plan was to get a 300 tpi to pair with my 790.  I found out some stuff, the XC-w looks to be really the only ones left to strike any deal on.  With me selling my 450L and my YZ450F I cannot ride with my friends I would normally ride with.

 

If I went the 300 XC-W route, I really do not know where I could ride it, CC (which I never have ridden) the desert and Bee Canyon is all I really know.  Oh and McCain, been there once but did not ride long, someone's bike broke maybe 30 min into the ride.   Or get a 500 EXC,  Yes I just sold a 450L but I do know the 500 will handle a bit better in the rougher stuff than my 450L would but not as good as the 300.  But the 500 will allow me to still ride with a few of my friends that do more technical dual sport.

 

I am ready to buy now, so I just need to decide.  I think the 500 is more practical and the 300 would be more fun but very limited.  I also know I need to throw about $3K at the 500 to get it setup and maybe $1500 at the 300

 

anyways as usual Thanks in advance.  I get really good information from people in here and I appreciate it

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What is it about the Honda that didn't work for you?  I'm just curious, the KTM and Honda are similar enough....obviously the KTM has a bit more performance but it's not going to be astronomically different. 

I was recently gifted an older KTM two stroke, a 2005 250SX and at first I was so used to riding my four stroke that I wasn't a fan.  After a weekend of playing in the desert with it, I am trying to convince myself to just add a few things to it and get rid of the 450.   The only reason I haven't done so is to go ride with friends on DS rides.  I don't do lots of miles of that during any year, so trying to decide.  I have the large ADV bike to do things not involving single track.

It's good to have so many choices, and also bad!  Glad I have a few bikes to use, can't stop at just one!

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Pokey you are an accomplished MX guy.

For a 2 stroke line- I promise if you pair a solid TPI  250 or 300cc bike with your nice DS bike you will rip with big smile and this is about having a fun day riding. I will throw my big arsed opinion in. Get the Husky (not too available now)or the Gas Gas (still available) . Truth is Husky will be very hard to find by now.

I say that (Husky/G-G)because for all around use the linkage bike will serve your muscle memory feel system better. I have owned , raced, ridden well prepped FC suspended PDS KTMs in the past but I ride 90% single track enduro xc type stuff.  For overall use, single track hard stuff/Dez days/H&H type stuff/ and occasional Track day etc etc the linkage bike is better rounded to handle the mix you can throw at it. Then you decide between TE250i, TE300i, EC300 and if we have it the EC250. You can also consider a Beta 300RR Race, however I think Beta is on the cusp of building the fuel injected 2 stroke as well. The KTM products are all C/B shaft engines and are state of the art and smooth an silk.  The Betas are super well balanced but not as sewing machine smooth as the KTM products. 

250 or 300, Im 210 I like 300s forever, short shift lower RPM Euro style offroad riding. As well as for low rpm no wheelspin hard stuff work.  I do have A level offroad guys I know that prefer 250s for their "quicker" response. 

So if you throw a 250 into your mix I would be wrong not to include the YZ250X into the mix , tech wise its full on "old school" premix no C/B but hell they are bullet proof and with a good enduro build are brilliant do anything machines.

For a 4 stroke single track enduro/xc discussion my big arse opinion centers around the tweener size bikes. Sherco has the 300SEFR (amazing machine and there is a (ex LR) low hour MY19 one at GP motos right now) Beta (C&D) has them big time 390 , 350 (more my type). KTM 350, Husky 350 (not my faves at all) , and for some exotica Checkpoint Offroad (Matt Stavish) is the importer for the Italian RedMoto machines - example CRF300RX. 

My familiarity with tweener size 4T comes from very fun and successful plastic trophy ammie years with 2011 TE310 and 2013 TXC310R Italian Husky after coming off 04,06.and 08 450s. 

My very personal answer is my DS 1999 TE610 Husqvarna (Italian) side gig for fun on the old world enduro champ

TE300i 2021 new hardcore trail/enduro XC machine for fun and comp, this bike is incomparable. PS you are welcome to ride it- I am the GP boss designated Husky ambassador (hahahaa) 

These are my core pair, I have my 92 Beta Trials machine as well and couple more project collection bikes too.

 

 

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On 4/30/2020 at 6:54 AM, Bluhdow said:

I have a 2001 YZ 250 that's built for the track. The entire bike (motor top + bottom, suspension, controls, plastics, seat, everything) was rebuilt about 8 (engine) hours ago. 

I had the chance to ride it back-to-back with a 2020 Husky 300 with fuel and oil injection last weekend. The bikes are world's apart. 

The new 300 has a MUCH smoother power delivery, and almost didn't feel like a 2 stroke with the lack of a wild, surging powerband. It had plenty of power for sure...it was just a lot more linear. It rode well in lower RPMs and everything about it just felt...lovely. Plus the injection runs it nice and lean so you don't spit oil everywhere.

I still love my 250 for laps at Fox, but I'll never look at it the same way out in the open desert.

How much would a flywheel weight and/or Hinson Momentum clutch basket smooth out your YZ?

Ever try different pipe designs or a G2 throttle tamer?

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31 minutes ago, tntmo said:

It's good to have so many choices, and also bad!  Glad I have a few bikes to use, can't stop at just one!

Wise words!

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27 minutes ago, Goofy Footer said:

How much would a flywheel weight and/or Hinson Momentum clutch basket smooth out your YZ?

Ever try different pipe designs or a G2 throttle tamer?

I've built up 2 trail oriented YZ250s both installs using the middle weight 11oz FWW as well as my ex YZ125 with the 9oz mid weight FWW on that bike.

Steahly FWW for all 3 .  They make a world of difference in all aspects, control, traction and even suspension. It really is a must do cheap and very effective mod for building an off road YZ.

For the 250s FMF Gnarley boosted the bottom and both with Turbine core 2 silencers. very clean (read step leaner) side JD jetting jet kits along with IX iridium plugs. 50:1 Maxima Super M and/or K2 for those lower RPM used 250s and with cooler rich mixture ratios

YZ125 Pro Circuit Platinum with shorty muffler (not so S/A legal) gave us the best power. JD Jetting clean , IX plug, 32:1 Maxima  . brownish black exhaust at outlet zero spooge clean  jetted. 9 oz FWW no stall ripper  

So there are my YZ offroad stories...... the only real option from Japan.

The newer offroad YZ250X is already a super base machine.

and I could see a "300" kitted YZ really doing work in the single track. The South African Roof of Africa YZ builds are world class

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3 hours ago, tntmo said:

What is it about the Honda that didn't work for you?  I'm just curious, the KTM and Honda are similar enough....obviously the KTM has a bit more performance but it's not going to be astronomically different. 

 

The weight.  That was about it.  I loved the bike but wanted something I could enjoy more doing stuff like the Soboba trail ride.  I have not done hard single track, just a good solid moderate.    I 100% love riding in snow and that honda was good at that but again you felt the weight.  I would have liked just a touch more power but was not necessary.

3 hours ago, robertaccio said:

Pokey you are an accomplished MX guy.

For a 2 stroke line- I promise if you pair a solid TPI  250 or 300cc bike with your nice DS bike you will rip with big smile and this is about having a fun day riding. I will throw my big arsed opinion in. Get the Husky (not too available now)or the Gas Gas (still available) . Truth is Husky will be very hard to find by now.

I say that (Husky/G-G)because for all around use the linkage bike will serve your muscle memory feel system better. I have owned , raced, ridden well prepped FC suspended PDS KTMs in the past but I ride 90% single track enduro xc type stuff.  For overall use, single track hard stuff/Dez days/H&H type stuff/ and occasional Track day etc etc the linkage bike is better rounded to handle the mix you can throw at it. Then you decide between TE250i, TE300i, EC300 and if we have it the EC250. You can also consider a Beta 300RR Race, however I think Beta is on the cusp of building the fuel injected 2 stroke as well. The KTM products are all C/B shaft engines and are state of the art and smooth an silk.  The Betas are super well balanced but not as sewing machine smooth as the KTM products. 

250 or 300, Im 210 I like 300s forever, short shift lower RPM Euro style offroad riding. As well as for low rpm no wheelspin hard stuff work.  I do have A level offroad guys I know that prefer 250s for their "quicker" response. 

So if you throw a 250 into your mix I would be wrong not to include the YZ250X into the mix , tech wise its full on "old school" premix no C/B but hell they are bullet proof and with a good enduro build are brilliant do anything machines.

For a 4 stroke single track enduro/xc discussion my big arse opinion centers around the tweener size bikes. Sherco has the 300SEFR (amazing machine and there is a (ex LR) low hour MY19 one at GP motos right now) Beta (C&D) has them big time 390 , 350 (more my type). KTM 350, Husky 350 (not my faves at all) , and for some exotica Checkpoint Offroad (Matt Stavish) is the importer for the Italian RedMoto machines - example CRF300RX. 

My familiarity with tweener size 4T comes from very fun and successful plastic trophy ammie years with 2011 TE310 and 2013 TXC310R Italian Husky after coming off 04,06.and 08 450s. 

My very personal answer is my DS 1999 TE610 Husqvarna (Italian) side gig for fun on the old world enduro champ

TE300i 2021 new hardcore trail/enduro XC machine for fun and comp, this bike is incomparable. PS you are welcome to ride it- I am the GP boss designated Husky ambassador (hahahaa) 

These are my core pair, I have my 92 Beta Trials machine as well and couple more project collection bikes too.

 

 

Yes, I know the 2 strokes will far outshine.  I have been debating about a linkage and availability for the most part.   The biggest thing holding me back from a 2stroke is just riding locations and riding partners.   For choosing the KTM, I get a better deal on those vs Husky and GG and they seem similar enough motor wise. The XC to the TE that is, well I think at least

I will refer to the Soboba trail ride again.  When I have my 05 450EXC, the rougher it got, then better the bike felt.  The Honda was the complete opposite.  The EXC was lighter and no linkage.  I wish the 05 had more power.  The Honda had way better power in comparison.

 

 

Tough decisions.  Thank you

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8 hours ago, Pokey151 said:

I also know I need to throw about $3K at the 500 to get it setup and maybe $1500 at the 300

I am not nearly as good of a rider as I suspect you are; so take this with a grain of salt!  I love my 650 for some things and I love my 500 for others.  At the end of the day, "ready to race", even for me, is not even close on these bikes, which is kinda disappointing. I did pull the smog and reed valve, cleaned up the muffler, added a JD Tuner and had George redo the suspension and I am finally happy with the bike.  

Good luck on making your decision!

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Gotta add if another well rounded do it all bike is in consideration, one of my competitors in the 50+ class is a multi time ISDE vet who rides a KTM450EXCF (PDS) machine and is a top 3-5 guy in the serious enduro/xc races , he is a Tecate enduro class winner on that bike. He even says a 300 2T would be great on that race day but for 200 days out of the year he is riding trails and connecting stuff with his plate. So yea there are so many choices!! If you get any machine you are welcome to join our crew anytime. We have one of those whattsapp groups of core guys there are rides on mixed days of the week. Everyone are solid some are C level most are solid B and and a few are A level enduro guys with a couple ex pros thrown in from time to time. we are riding tomorrow for example (Fri)

Also there is a huge difference from your 2005 and todays models in all respects from chassis to engine

 

 

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