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To be consistent don't let me catch you using the toilets. Oh wait, there won't be any toilets.

:ohno02:

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I got asked for one last time I parked at Corral so I just get the annual and be done with it.

Of course 15 Jeeps parked for a minute, then headed out to use the park....no pass required. Hmmmm......

Anyway, see where it goes.

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To be consistent don't let me catch you using the toilets. Oh wait, there won't be any toilets.

:ohno02:

I can see it now. Coin operated outhouses!

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To be consistent don't let me catch you using the toilets. Oh wait, there won't be any toilets.

:ohno02:

I can see it now. Coin operated outhouses!

Big Bend in Texas. Nation Park campground with ammenties. 6 quarters to use the shower. ;)

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Let's be honest...its a tax on top of a tax; you can hike in, ride in, or drive in, and recreated that way, but once you leave your vehicle in the forest (already paid for with taxes) you need another pass. i'm not saying it's inconsistent with other fees associated with tax-funded operations, it's just that all the money seems to go toward "less" not more...close down trails, more enforcement...not new trails.

And like the green sticker funds, they are squirreling away the money, then raiding it for other projects.

That being said; I've always had one (thanks Paul for the most recent one) and would continue to purchase it, and naively hope it is being administered wisely

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To be consistent don't let me catch you using the toilets. Oh wait, there won't be any toilets.

:ohno02:

I can see it now. Coin operated outhouses!

Well, we better have two...coin operated for American citizens and free ones for illegal immigrants so as to not offend them...

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If you look at the reality parking on Sunrise Hwy a county maintained road you pay tax for, you must pay more to be in the USDA Forest Service Mount Laguna Recreation Area and an additional fee for Adventure pass?? It has been a scam from day one! My 2 cents. :ph34r:

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Carguy- that's what I'm saying...tax on a tax...the "improved areas" like campgrounds, I understand an additional fee for, and since I DO use the "improved" campgrounds within Corral, I've never had an issue with the pass for that reason. but, like you say...pull over on the highway to look at the view, and you need a pass........first snow, every year, I see all the flatlanders getting ticketed right and left due to no posted pass.....

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Anyone been checked recently or know if they've stopped requiring these yet? Mine is still good for quite a while but curious if these clowns are trying to enforce it and bully people into believing it's still valid.

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We camped at Corral a couple weeks ago and forgot the pass. Raced to PV and back in the morning for a day pass. Saw the ranger on the way out. We made it back in time, but I think she only checked Bobcat, then left.

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Anyone been checked recently or know if they've stopped requiring these yet? Mine is still good for quite a while but curious if these clowns are trying to enforce it and bully people into believing it's still valid.

by clowns and bullies, are you referring perhaps to rangers like Tull, who's responsible for opening more trail at CC than anyone I know?

The guy who rides and advocates for more off-road use in these areas?

That "clown" and "bully"?

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Please forgive my frustration. I know that there is a VERY small minority of rangers and people in the USFS and BLM who care about recreationalists and especially people who use off road vehicles. The norm at the Pine Valley exit parking area is for the rangers to troll everyone who parks there. I'm the guy who does everything right, pays my fees, registers my bikes, runs a S/A and keep my DS bike in compliance with the letter of the law. I still get the shake down all the time! If the actual police acted the way a lot of these guys/gals do, there would be (and is when real cops do it)an outrage from the public because the bottom line is that it's illegal to do what a lot of them are doing. They seem to think they are above the law and can make up the rules to suit them. It doesn't matter if I'm on a DS ride or backpacking on a 12,000' mountain peak, I still get hassled by wanna be mall cops. In more then a few cases, they have been volunteers who are ignorant to the actual laws or regulations of the area they are "patrolling". So if you're a ranger and you're reading this, use a little courtesy and tact when dealing with people at trailheads or in the backcountry and learn the laws and latest policies. We aren't criminals, we're the ones paying your salary.

True story....On an overnight backpacking trip last year on San Gorgonio, we were coming down off the summit and as we clear the last switchback to the mineshaft saddle area, the trail forks. I see a guy standing there in full on tactical gear looking like he's about to go on a door kicking OP in the Helmand province. As we get closer I give him a little courtesy nod and say "good morning", he steps onto the trail to block it and yells "papers!". For a second I really thought he was just joking around, but he wasn't. Before my buddy who's carrying our permit can even get it out of his shirt pocket, the guy is on the radio saying "I've got three detained". On his tac vest was a USFS Volunteer patch. He checked our permit and we were "released" but are you freaking kidding me! I was livid! I really wish I would have got a name or something but at the time it seemed like the best option was to stay cool, de-escalate and get the heck out of there. That incident really ruined an otherwise awesome trip.

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Understood - for your consideration: I've stated this in other posts but since that's mostly what they have to do and they probably get evaluated on it, the bureaucracy drives their activity. On the other hand, if they do nothing, then people will complain that they're lazy. Catch 22. When I worked patrol at SDPD, people would complain when they saw us gathered at 7-11 or wherever - so we had a policy that no more than 2 cars at a "static" location at one time. We'd have to find somewhere out of the way to debrief calls or talk an officer through their response to holding their first dead baby. But if I wrote someone a well deserved ticket or took other enforcement action, I was an asshole. The job's a no win and always will be.

I agree about the courtesy - as all of us should be - so just be courteous and maybe it'll rub off. If someone's really a jerk, speak to their supervisor.

I've never had anyone be a jerk with me but I've wondered about the legality of them "searching" your bike for S/A, etc. I haven't read up the "if you enter BLM/OHV/NPS areas, you are subject to..." so maybe I'll do that.

The good thing about doing everything right, ya don't get cited and you're a good representative of the moto-community.

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Fastrich- I get it...in my experience, the pine valley team is different than the corral canyon team. The Pine Valley team has: written me up for a valid permit that fell from my mirror on to my dash...I got there while she was pulling out her book; she continued writing! THEN she grabs her little wire thingie, and checks the spark arrestor on my STOCK DRZ...then moves on to the next group...within Corral, I have had nothing but great experiences with the rangers. Handing out maps, offering water bottles, asking about trail conditions...big difference (to me)

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Fastrich- I get it...in my experience, the pine valley team is different than the corral canyon team. The Pine Valley team has: written me up for a valid permit that fell from my mirror on to my dash...I got there while she was pulling out her book; she continued writing! THEN she grabs her little wire thingie, and checks the spark arrestor on my STOCK DRZ...then moves on to the next group...within Corral, I have had nothing but great experiences with the rangers. Handing out maps, offering water bottles, asking about trail conditions...big difference (to me)

Yeah, I've had the same treatment from that hag. It takes me to a really bad place when those monkeys want to touch my bike. You're right about CC though, there are a couple who are much more personable up there. Years ago it seemed like most of the rangers and blm were like that, freindly conversations, handing out maps and trash bags, generally cool and happy to engage people with courtesy. It would be great to see it again on a large scale.

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Please forgive my frustration. I know that there is a VERY small minority of rangers and people in the USFS and BLM who care about recreationalists and especially people who use off road vehicles. The norm at the Pine Valley exit parking area is for the rangers to troll everyone who parks there. I'm the guy who does everything right, pays my fees, registers my bikes, runs a S/A and keep my DS bike in compliance with the letter of the law. I still get the shake down all the time! If the actual police acted the way a lot of these guys/gals do, there would be (and is when real cops do it)an outrage from the public because the bottom line is that it's illegal to do what a lot of them are doing. They seem to think they are above the law and can make up the rules to suit them. It doesn't matter if I'm on a DS ride or backpacking on a 12,000' mountain peak, I still get hassled by wanna be mall cops. In more then a few cases, they have been volunteers who are ignorant to the actual laws or regulations of the area they are "patrolling". So if you're a ranger and you're reading this, use a little courtesy and tact when dealing with people at trailheads or in the backcountry and learn the laws and latest policies. We aren't criminals, we're the ones paying your salary.

True story....On an overnight backpacking trip last year on San Gorgonio, we were coming down off the summit and as we clear the last switchback to the mineshaft saddle area, the trail forks. I see a guy standing there in full on tactical gear looking like he's about to go on a door kicking OP in the Helmand province. As we get closer I give him a little courtesy nod and say "good morning", he steps onto the trail to block it and yells "papers!". For a second I really thought he was just joking around, but he wasn't. Before my buddy who's carrying our permit can even get it out of his shirt pocket, the guy is on the radio saying "I've got three detained". On his tac vest was a USFS Volunteer patch. He checked our permit and we were "released" but are you freaking kidding me! I was livid! I really wish I would have got a name or something but at the time it seemed like the best option was to stay cool, de-escalate and get the heck out of there. That incident really ruined an otherwise awesome trip.

This seems to be the increasing experience with people with all forms of law enforcement. PAPERS PLEASE!

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Personally I don't object to the adventure pass fee, seems good value if administered properly, nice to actually have toilets at 4 corners these days. But not happy when our fees are taken away to fund other projects.

I have met ranger Tull and his team a few times when helping cut the new trails and just around and we are so fortunate to have someone like that here and while I've never had any trouble I'm quite happy that they are checking for illegal riding, vehicles etc. so we can keep these limited riding areas open.

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