There's Food in My Gas

[Spyder 2]

I am tired of fighting with Corn Syrup.

It has been a loosing battle these last few months trying to repair motorcycles, small 4 stroke equipment and 2 stroke stuff. I will not get into the political side of this; let's just say I do not like corn in my fuel. Or better yet; I don't like what damage it does to motors and carbs, mileage reduction, etc. etc.

What I would like is advice on where to get alcohol-free fuel.....?

It used to be available at the pump until recently. You had to look for it, but it was around. Marine applications used it. Racers used it. I can't find it...

I was rotating the ethanol fuels out of most of my equipment after 60 to 90 days and any gas on hand went in the truck after 60. Obviously, that was not soon enough and the fuel broke down and dissolved anything rubber. Generally just making a mess of things. Sta-bil additive was added to the ToyHauler and Boat if storage was long term. It did not seem to make any significant difference. TH Generator required about $500 in repairs. I have not delved into the boat yet. That one is going to be expensive....

Most of you ride frequently enough to not have this trouble in your bikes. If you have not seen the damage first hand, good for you. Just let me say it's a nasty pain in the ass. I run Chevron Premium with Techron in everything. Never the cheap stuff. Repair shops have recomended that and the 76 Premium. But also say to use additives....

So....

What are you using for Alcohol Free Fuels?

Where are you getting it at the 'pump'?

Are you getting it elsewhere in cans or jugs?

And, also ...

If you use the Kitchen Grade stuff.

What addiitives have proven effective in specific applications?

Thanks,

S

The following are currently junked up from the Corn.

SXC

2 Lawnmowers

2 Garden Tractors

2 Chainsaws

Tiller

Pressure Washer

Stand-by Generator

Chipper

[amgems 79]

Here is a web site that has stations that sell ethanol free gas:

http://pure-gas.org/

I have been using regular old Sta-Bil and have not had any problems with my new bike. On my 07 KTM 450 the accelerator pump diaphram cracked and started leaking after a few years. Maybe from ethanol?

[Spyder 2]

Here is a web site that has stations that sell ethanol free gas:

http://pure-gas.org/

I have been using regular old Sta-Bil and have not had any problems with my new bike. On my 07 KTM 450 the accelerator pump diaphram cracked and started leaking after a few years. Maybe from ethanol?

Yep I had tried the Pure Gas website, thanks. I should have said "at the Pump" because it did not list anything "at the pump" closer than Parker, Az. on their site. I'll edit OP.

[Spaugh 1]

you can get 100 octane street blaze (or something similar) VP race fuel down at a pump in PB and also in El Cajon right off the 8. Its like 10$ a gallon though... I know you don't want to hear it but I leave the regular old pump gas in all my stuff, cars, trucks, lawn mower, chain saw, weed eater, leaf blower, generator, dirt bike (4T, and 2T) sitting for months even years at a time and have never had any of them get fouled up let alone rubber breaking down. Have read lots of other people's complaints but never witnessed it personally.

Maybe stop using the stabilizer? Good luck in your quest to find non ethenol gas, I don't think you will have much luck in CA finding anything other than av gas or VP race gas.

[Wintyfresh 46]

you can get 100 octane street blaze (or something similar) VP race fuel down at a pump in PB and also in El Cajon right off the 8.

Also VP in Rancho Santa Fe.

[socalhodaka 105]

I have felt your pain. For my 3 modern 4 strokes I start them every other week. I have never had a problem with the 2 strokes sitting. Lucky I have my RV here at the house a start the gen monthly. For the lawn equipment I run them enough. I do know at the lawn mower shop you can buy lead fuel in a 1/2 gal, it cost around 5 bucks. The guy said its just for this issue.

[97xr400r 122]

Don't know if its pure gas but it smelled like the good stuff white exhaust and all. It think it was $8 a gal. I always just run 91, but the 11:1 XR400 really liked that stuff.

1683 Ben Hulse Hwy, Brawley, CA

google is showing a strange location for the texaco but it's at the above address next to the jack in the box.

[amgems 79]

This is a long read, but a very interesting article:

http://www.goldeagle.com/UserFiles/file/STA-BIL%20files/White_Paper_Ethanol_%20Blended_Gasline.pdf

[Spyder 2]

you can get 100 octane street blaze (or something similar) VP race fuel down at a pump in PB and also in El Cajon right off the 8. Its like 10$ a gallon though... I know you don't want to hear it but I leave the regular old pump gas in all my stuff, cars, trucks, lawn mower, chain saw, weed eater, leaf blower, generator, dirt bike (4T, and 2T) sitting for months even years at a time and have never had any of them get fouled up let alone rubber breaking down. Have read lots of other people's complaints but never witnessed it personally.

Maybe stop using the stabilizer? Good luck in your quest to find non ethenol gas, I don't think you will have much luck in CA finding anything other than av gas or VP race gas.

My right or your right? Which place off the 8?

SoCo off the 8 and 67 or the Quik Trip off Mollison and 8?

10 Pure Gas Stations in California

City Brand Octane Name Street Address GPS*

Blythe UNBRANDED 91 Parker Oil [760-922-7600] 391 S Main St N33.60389 W114.59935 details

Bradley UNBRANDED 89 Lake Nacimiento Marina [805-238-1056] 10625 Nacimiento Lk Dr N35.78930 W120.87805 details

Bradley UNBRANDED Lake San Antonio Marina [805-472-2313] 74255 San Antonio Rd N35.81536 W120.97960 details

Corning UNBRANDED 93 Northern Lights Energy [530-824-3204] 1819 Solano St N39.92771 W122.19008 details

Eureka UNBRANDED 91 92 Renner Petroleum [707-443-1645] 1100 W 14th St N40.79426 W124.18354 details

Fortuna UNBRANDED 91 Renner Petroleum [707-725-2364] 2435 Newburg Rd N40.59170 W124.14071 details

Garberville UNBRANDED 91 Renner Petroleum [707-923-3380] 76 Bear Canyon Rd N40.10976 W123.79529 details

Leggett UNBRANDED 91 Leggett Patriots [707-925-6099] 67670 Hwy 271 N39.86477 W123.71492 details

Redding UNBRANDED 93 Northern Lights Energy [530-241-2196] 2340 Wyndham Ln N40.56153 W122.38740 details

San Diego VP RACING 100 Crown Point Auto Center [858-866-0230] 3804 Ingraham St N32.78875 W117.23749 details

I called the guy in PB he said all pumps there have ethanol.

Stabilizer was only in the boat and hauler generator. I try to run equipment every thirty days, but it ends up sometimes being every other month...

Spaugh, you are Blessed and Lucky.

At $10 a gallon it still looks like a good option for the small motors. One repair shop had little cans of Small Motor Fuel for $10/2 quart can ($20/gal). Big jump from yours, Kelly.

What do the Off Road guys use for fuel these days? (Obviously, I am out of the loop.) I don't know much about VP Fuels...

Please keep the suggestions comming.

Thanks

S

Going to read the PDF on Fuel.

Do you know that Mid Grades are generally mixed at point of purchase? They mix it in the tanks under the dispencery. How accurate is that?

How much fuel is in the hose from last transaction? If the last person purchased Regular grade and you pump Premium Grade. How much regular do you end up with in your tank? Important to know when testing for Ethanol Free using the test strips.

All of the gas and diesel (with few exceptions) comes down the same pipeline. All the factory numbers for fuels mean a lot less when the fuel is pushed down the same line. Alot of the time they do not use pigs to separate. Ethanol, to my knowledge is mixed in at the farm in Mission Valley.

I don't know the difference between Calif Winter and Summer gas.

This crap is way over my head, and generally I can say that most consumers no very little about the fuel they burn up in their vehicles.

[carguy 1]

I run cheap pump gas in almost everything except the 950 & Harley They use premium. I put Sta-Bil in everything but the chain saw as the mix has a stabilizer in it. That's Pressure washer, wood splitter, generator lawn mower and all the fleet bikes and vehicles. No issues so far. Had cheap pump gas in the RV gas station for almost a year and it still was good.

[Spyder 2]

Good find Amgems, thanks.

From the article:

Q: Have any tests been performed to determine the compatibility of ethanol with fuel system

parts?

A: Yes, several tests have been performed which indicate that blends containing up to 10v% ethanol

are compatible with the metals and elastomers in modern vehicle fuel systems.

Q. Will ethanol result in reduced fuel economy?

A. The addition of ethanol will usually result in a fuel economy loss of about 2-3%. This has been

confirmed through numerous tests.

Q. Does ethanol cause vapor lock and hot restart problems?

A. The tendency of a fuel to contribute to vapor lock and hot restart problems is defined by its overall

volatility characteristics. This includes the fuel's distillation characteristics, vapor pressure, and vapor

liquid ratio. Vapor lock and hot restart problems are primarily a summertime problem. Today the

summertime volatility of all fuels, including those containing ethanol, is controlled by the EPA volatility

regulations. Consequently, hot driveability problems related to fuel volatility have been largely

eliminated.

Q: What about using gasoline ethanol blends in power equipment and other small engine

applications?

A: Nearly every mainstream manufacturer has indicated that ethanol blended fuels containing up to

10v% ethanol can be used in their products. A small number of manufacturers indicate that minor

adjustments may be necessary or recommend special precautions.

What adjustments and special precautions?

Most of the Ethanol use is aimed at vehicles, so its made for their use. Small engines take a back seat. There are so many products like Sta-Bil now it is hard to know which do what and actually work.

Most of the rubber parts I have had trouble with look dehydrated and are brittle and hard leaving them susceptible to breakage by movement or slightest touch. Not soft and supple anymore. While a pain in the ass to replace. The bigger problem is equipment in Stand By use. The Generator started leaking in the garage where a water heater is located. So really, safety is a big concern here.

John, I hope the boat which had Sta-Bil in it, is alright. I'll have to dig into it in the next few weeks.

More please!~

[PastaPilot 17]

Stop by your local airport and buy 100LL. No ethanol to be found, lasts for years in the tank. The lead additives are not good for catalytic converters, however valvetrains love it.

Gillespie - $6.15/gal

Montgomery - $6/gal

Brown - $5.50/gal

Palomar - $5.70/gal

Ramona - $5.75/gal

I run the lowest priced local pump gas in everything and have never used a stabilizer. No problems to report.

Oh yeah and unless your vehicle requires premium/high octane fuels you're just throwing your money away and the it will probably run better on 87.

[Spyder 2]

Jon, thanks.

How does one get onto the airfield for fuel? What containers can I use? Suggestions?

Damage from Gen.

O Ring lower left for comparrison. Hose does not bend and has cracks from inside to out and sloughs chunks...

[PastaPilot 17]

Just show up with LARGE containers and start asking around. You'll want to find an FBO and ask if they'll sell it to you. If you're around Montgomery Field, Gibbs Flying Service or CrownAir will sell it to you.

[Spaugh 1]

quick trip. race fuel isn't going to work very well in anything other than a race engine although it *may* help with your issue of rotting parts. engines aren't going to make as much power (or even get a complete burn) with race gas unless they are tuned for it.

[Spyder 2]

This looks promising depending on price...

[PbdBlue 46]

I never found Stabil to be very effective. I switched to Seafoam and have not had any problems since. I put it in all the desert toys at the end of the season last year and every one of them fired right up after sitting for over 5 months with full fuel tanks. So far I'm sold.

http://seafoamsales.com/sea-foam-motor-treatment/

[amgems 79]

I read an article once about gasoline storage. I can't find it on line now. Basically it said (this is from my faulty memory), that where you store your gas is important. Gas stored in an environment that has big temperature swings and high humidity is not good. Like a garage or shed. THe temperature swings can cause condesation to form on the inside of the tank. Not good, water gets in the gas. Can't remember the details, but, with ethanol in the gas it asorbs that water and seperates the ethanol from the gas, making a concentrated level of ethanol that can damage rubber stuff. If it stays mixed with the gasoline it's not as concentrated and less harmful. The best place to store gas is in a warm, dry area, that has as stable a temp as possible, in an air tight container. So, the best place to store your gas is in the living room (I just made this part up).

[Spyder 2]

I read an article once about gasoline storage. I can't find it on line now. Basically it said (this is from my faulty memory), that where you store your gas is important. Gas stored in an environment that has big temperature swings and high humidity is not good. Like a garage or shed. THe temperature swings can cause condesation to form on the inside of the tank. Not good, water gets in the gas. Can't remember the details, but, with ethanol in the gas it asorbs that water and seperates the ethanol from the gas, making a concentrated level of ethanol that can damage rubber stuff. If it stays mixed with the gasoline it's not as concentrated and less harmful. The best place to store gas is in a warm, dry area, that has as stable a temp as possible, in an air tight container. So, the best place to store your gas is in the living room (I just made this part up).

Yup, I aggree and to add it should be in Metal Containers as chemicals will migrate through plastic.

Where is the most gas stored in the US of A?

S

[dirt dame 561]

The best place to store gas is in a warm, dry area, that has as stable a temp as possible, in an air tight container. So, the best place to store your gas is in the living room (I just made this part up).

My house would blow up if any fumes escaped into the lowboy furnace!

[PastaPilot 17]

Where is the most gas stored in the US of A?

S

Underground.

[Spyder 2]

The consumers have the most fuel at any one time in the US of A. The fuel tanks in their vehicles.

[AATA 0]

Personally I have never tried it, but there's a bunch of videos on youtube and a buddy of mine in the landscape business does this on a larger scale for all his equipment. I don't know the details and I'm not a chemist, but I guess if you mix water with gas and let it sit, the 2 separate and the water pulls the ethanol out of the gas. You then drain one from the other.

Personally I use Seafoam on the boat and a pit bike we have. I start my bikes and yard equipment enough to prevent any issues.

[Spyder 2]

Seafoam is an answer I have been hearing from quite a few folks. Sounds like it is worth a try.

For the Standby Generator I have decided not to take any chances with starting and for the fuel to last up to a year in the sealed container.

KISS

Much more expensive, but no worries about the ethanol and related problems.

http://www.vp-sef.com/index.php/why-vp-sef

Simple.

Now on to the other equipemnt.....

S

[Uncle Champ 116]

I just installed the new tank from IMS, they were adamant that I change the cap too. They state the rubber seal on the old style cap degrades causing issues, also Martins Motos is having a rash of petcock related failures. I did some checking the word is fuel in Texas is so bad it lasts one month before degrading.