Another Tire Thread

[Spaugh 1]

Everyone has an opinion so let me have it please! I'm going to Utah in April (anyone looking to do some technical riding with great scenery is welcome to join us) and am deciding what rear tires to use. For fronts I'm sticking to the Pirelli XCMHs, they have soft rubber, stiff sidewalls, and good knobs. They work awesome in rocks and pretty good everywhere else, only downside is they don't last that long and there are better tires for sand.

For rear, here are the 3 categories its down to:

1.) trials tire - don't need DOT. I've only used a D803 before and it is super soft and lasted forever and held up to rocks. leaning, turning, and aggressive riding in fast terrain was not on par with a knobby. maybe the safest bet for UT, but I really don't like them for local riding so its kind of a waste to buy one and then take it off before its worn out.

2.) hard terrain knobby - never used one. in theory they have softer rubber for rocks and still have a round shape and side knobs for turning. tempting to try one. do they work on rocks and which one to use?

3.) FIM enduro tire - never used one. in theory the big round shape is good for low pressure and has big contact patch. plus they still have knobs for sand and turning but not sure about the rubber compound. Which one is the best and how soft is the rubber? how long will it last in really rocky/sharp trails?

[HVYWT 3]

Everyone has an opinion so let me have it please! I'm going to Utah in April (anyone looking to do some technical riding with great scenery is welcome to join us) and am deciding what rear tires to use. For fronts I'm sticking to the Pirelli XCMHs, they have soft rubber, stiff sidewalls, and good knobs. They work awesome in rocks and pretty good everywhere else, only downside is they don't last that long and there are better tires for sand.

For rear, here are the 3 categories its down to:

1.) trials tire - don't need DOT. I've only used a D803 before and it is super soft and lasted forever and held up to rocks. leaning, turning, and aggressive riding in fast terrain was not on par with a knobby. maybe the safest bet for UT, but I really don't like them for local riding so its kind of a waste to buy one and then take it off before its worn out.

2.) hard terrain knobby - never used one. in theory they have softer rubber for rocks and still have a round shape and side knobs for turning. tempting to try one. do they work on rocks and which one to use?

3.) FIM enduro tire - never used one. in theory the big round shape is good for low pressure and has big contact patch. plus they still have knobs for sand and turning but not sure about the rubber compound. Which one is the best and how soft is the rubber? how long will it last in really rocky/sharp trails?

Never thought of it that way . Thought hard terrain were harder ?

[Spaugh 1]

its the terrain thats hard. trials tires are the ultimate hard terrain tires and they are extremely soft rubber and small knobs. conversely soft terrain tires have big hard knobs for biting into sand and soft dirt. intermediate tires are a compromise and more general purpose.

[robertaccio 412]

I'll check in but y'all know my take. I always talk about these. and use them for years now. Ive pulled holeshots in pure sand on my 450 with these because the actual carcass is like a balloon and float up on top. For sharp stuff that same carcass acts like a trials tire and wraps around stuff with great edcr absorbtion. unlike trials tires they are designed to ride/slide/and power around corners at speed, the side walls are more flexible than mX tires but a less flexxy then the high sidewall trials tires. FIM tires are DOT and designed not to dig the crap out terrain EU is very picky about that stuff FIM has complied. PS you dont need big knobs on rocks you need more surface area and carcass flex for grip. Brad you're an engineer do some research, you find my thoughts are well backed with facts and science, as well as my own experience. IMHO alot of folks using trials tires are trying to accomplish whats all ready been done for non-trials bikes, using FIM enduro comp tires (always 13psi and under, I ran mine at 12F and 10R now i use michelin mousses so its no issue)

FIM enduro tires, Pirelli Scorpion Pros (easiest and cheapest of the FIM to get here in the US). I would use any of the brands but pirellis are readily availble here.

Factual- Most every extreme enduro superstar (erxberg winners, romaniac winners,roof of africa winners etc) uses FIM enduro comp tires the added key for them is their use of drilled and cut Mousses for a single digital psi feel.

if you use tubes go with michelin airstop HDs at 10psi or even less in rear and 12 or less up front.

if using them go with the 90/90-21 front for all sizes and 120/90-18 size for 250 and - 4T and 249 and- 2Ts. 250+ 2 stroke and 350+ 4T go with the 140/80-18. I use 120/90-18 on my 310 because its really a 250 size machine.

[Spaugh 1]

fully agree with all of that. how soft is the rubber on the FIM tires? how long do they last? which brand is best, do all brands make a 120/18 FIM? There are 4 of us going all on 144-190cc 2 strokes. Briana wants a trials tire, but I'm leaning to a FIM or hard terrain tire.

maybe crawdaddy or others who removed stock ktm/husky tires wants to sell me the stock rear tire?

[Bagstr 288]

Sign me up. I love the straight up the goat trail grip of the MT43, but ripping out of a corner is either great or you lose the rear. Lack of a rounded profile is a negative.

Pirelli Scorpion Pro, next up. Great explanation. CID has been trying to tell about the trials of Trials

Now let's have a Mousse discussion!

Hard to install, OK on pavement?? Hi-Jack!!

B

[robertaccio 412]

The FIM rubber is intermediate hardness (more to the soft side compound by my feel check) made for all terrain-mud-sand- rocks as best as that compromise can be done.

I can not give you a life cycle, you know what and how I ride (tough terrain), it just depends on what I put them through, a couple-3 months at best. I lost a bunch of front side knobs at the last borcs xc race but my tire was a few months old and the trail was loaded with sharp rocks on side hills. Also for the rear I'm not a "stuck the bike wheel spinner" so I can keep mine alive and I just hack sawed my rear knobs to give it a little longer life.

the world enuro standard sizes are what I posted you guys will use 90/90-21s F and 120/90-18 rears for those smaller cc bikes. These are the industry standard sizes and Metzeler 6 days as well as Michelin Enduro comps are the same sizes, Golden Tyre will eventually make it here and they may have some different sizes to fill niches as well as compound choices (Jarvis' FIM tread tires are probably trials tire soft rubber as a works sponsored rider)

http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/ww/en/motorcycle/sheet/scorpion_pro_fim.html

National City Motorcycles orders all my tires and these are in within 2 days for the most part. They have a fast line on these tires (from my demand for them). Drop my name if you decide to get them from NCM.

PS moussses are not cheap but once you go there there's no going back to tubes (for trail riding)

[Spaugh 1]

Sign me up. I love the straight up the goat trail grip of the MT43, but ripping out of a corner is either great or you lose the rear. Lack of a rounded profile is a negative.

Pirelli Scorpion Pro, next up. Great explanation. CID has been trying to tell about the trials of Trials

Now let's have a Mousse discussion!

Hard to install, OK on pavement?? Hi-Jack!!

B

For UT we ran bridgestone HD tubes w less than 10 psi no flats after a week of rock bashing. In fact we are still running those same tubes from last year... for the cost and reliability for trail / fun riding ill stick to tubes. Even for racing ive never gotten a flat. For serious racers foams make a lot of sense. For novices like me i cant justify the 150$+ a piece.

[robertaccio 412]

Michelin actually makes 3 different FIM enduro comp fronts but the Enduro Comp 3e is the lastest and only rear they make, the lastest greatest front is the E comp 5 and is built as a multi terrain tire. The 4 front is a high grip (probably soft compound) and the MS is mixed surface model but older design.

Bags the mousse thing- yea no-go for street or should we say ok for limited street use. Basically not good for anything that heats the tires like high speed at constant speeds, the enemy of the mousse is heat also from friction heat for lack of inner tire lube. Dai Jone is also 100% mousse man, but he too is a 100% offroad guy like me. In the ISDE they do ride some street stuff so for short connecting trips no issues, you just dont want to ride from San Diego to pine valley all the way on streets.

Brad Got ya on the mousse cost thing I used HD and UHD tubes for years with no related dnf flats ever.

For a Baja hd tube story somewhere south of ranch santa v in rocky s/t I hit an embedded hard sharp rock at good speed and taco-d my front rim to below the tire bead on one side, my UHD tube was ballooned out under past the tire bead, i taped and zip tied it back in and rode the rest of the day with no no issues. Good HD tubes installed well can really be amazing.

I did use tube fillers for thorn protection always. Just use like you do, just use the high quality tubes, Brigestone, Michelin etc. not the cheapo ones.

[bikeslut 1]

ISDE97 was also running mousse- he detailed the same...high price but well worth it, especially if you are flat prone

[danrider 5]

This topic is right on time for me because I have been thinking about getting a MT43 tire.

[dirt dame 561]

Bridgestone still makes the M22-M23 series. One of the greatest hard terrain tires made and often used at Carlsbad. I used to run them there and at Corral Canyon back in the 80s. Sticks to slick stuff, doesn't wear all that well though. I've thought about running them again lately.

[zancat 0]

Bridgestone still makes the M22-M23 series. One of the greatest hard terrain tires made and often used at Carlsbad. I used to run them there and at Corral Canyon back in the 80s. Sticks to slick stuff, doesn't wear all that well though. I've thought about running them again lately.

I just ordered an MT43. Going to be my 1st trials tire experience. I am still 2nd guessing this decision though.... I am a 606 old school kinda guy.

Good to hear the reviews, tips and tricks.

Z

[hoss314 0]

maybe crawdaddy or others who removed stock ktm/husky tires wants to sell me the stock rear tire?

You can have mine...only has about 20 hours or so on it. Can't stand the stock KTM tires!

For me.....Michelin HD tubes with 11-12psi up front and 8-10psi in rear

Front: Pirelli Scorpion...(they do get tore up during the summer months with rocks tearing off the outer lugs. Have yet to try the MT43 front)

Rear: Maxxis Desert IT (only during desert season)

MT43 Trials tire for mountains and rocks during summer months

at least that is the tire combination I use for the 500EXC (950ADV is a different and much more expensive story)

[Spaugh 1]

maybe crawdaddy or others who removed stock ktm/husky tires wants to sell me the stock rear tire?

You can have mine...only has about 20 hours or so on it. Can't stand the stock KTM tires!

For me.....Michelin HD tubes with 11-12psi up front and 8-10psi in rear

Front: Pirelli Scorpion...(they do get tore up during the summer months with rocks tearing off the outer lugs. Have yet to try the MT43 front)

Rear: Maxxis Desert IT (only during desert season)

MT43 Trials tire for mountains and rocks during summer months

at least that is the tire combination I use for the 500EXC (950ADV is a different and much more expensive story)

hey hoss, that would be awesome. What kind of tire is it?

[HVYWT 3]

Cann't speach for him but it's probably a Michelin 140/80x18

[hoss314 0]

hey hoss, that would be awesome. What kind of tire is it?

Metzler 6 days

[Spaugh 1]

Ah the metzler 6 hr tire ( ive read others call it that). Maybe i better get a brand new tire for my trip. But if you go to the club meeting and bring the tire ill use it locally. I go through tires pretty quick, was surprised when you said its still new at 20 hrs.

[hoss314 0]

Not still new...only has about 20 hrs on it.

Still a pile of crap....brand new or used.

[Spaugh 1]

Not still new...only has about 20 hrs on it.

Still a pile of crap....brand new or used.

Bring it with you if you go to the club meeting. Pile of crap is OK if its a free pile of crap!

[SCHWINN 0]

This is the best tire thread we have ever had with some useful info from peeps that actually race and some people that use their tires and abuse tires as recreation.

At 1st I saw the "Another (Tired) Thread"...Glad I opened it.

There are actually some people I look up to on this site and listen to when they speak. Because they are out there and riding and racing.

[robertaccio 412]

Not still new...only has about 20 hrs on it.

Still a pile of crap....brand new or used.

Bring it with you if you go to the club meeting. Pile of crap is OK if its a free pile of crap! :)/>

Brad if that Metz 6 days fim tire came off the 500exc Im sure its a 140/80-18 not good for the little machines (120/90-18 is E1 bike size FIM rear rubber)

Anyway just an add on, ive been riding a xxxxxxx TXC310R with the OEM pirelli mx tires and did some comparo tests up the rock nasties, no doubt the FIM balloons offer much better consistant traction for true trials type stuff and my rear has been used and abused with its all ready low knobs cut and sharpened with my keep them alive hacksaw.

[hoss314 0]

Bring it with you if you go to the club meeting. Pile of crap is OK if its a free pile of crap! :)/>

Won't be going to the "club" meeting....I threw it in the back of my truck though.

[Spaugh 1]

Rob "hacksaw" Nantista.

[zancat 0]

Any pressure recommendations for the MT43? HD tube on a 450EXC, 85% dirt / desert. Mostly ride local Ramona and Anza Borrego.

As a preference reference point I ran 12 in the 606....

Thanks,

Z