Have you ever seen a desert turtle in our desert?

[Metal Twister 0]

I was talking to a local Historian the other day when he mentioned something that really peaked my interest. He made commit that both the Native American, and Early Settlers would collect the turtles up as they crossed the desert. They were easy to keep alive for long periods of time. Thus they could have a fresh meal when ever they wanted one. He claims that the southern deserts were hunted to extinction with a few still around in the central and northern upper desert.

I’ve been riding our local deserts for 40 plus years now with thousands and thousands of miles, and hours out there. I’ve seen all kinds of wild life. but never, not one time have I seen a turtle. In cars I can see how they might get over looked, but on bikes you notice everything that resembles a rock. I’ve never met any one that has seen a turtle in our desert. Dead or alive. How about an empty turtle shell? Has anyone here? Just curious, Thanks Bob

[bikeslut 1]

yeah, I have, but not for... like 30 years.

When i first started riding, I'd see one EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE while riding. They are not walking across expanses of sand, generally, but walking amongst the creosote, etc. We used to bring them back to camp and feed them... and snakes and tarantulas and scorpions... and the ever elusive double breasted bikini bird

[dirt dame 561]

Back in 1988 I found a desert tortoise under my truck at an observed trials meet in the Lucerne Valley near Cougar Buttes. I took him out of there, gave him an apple core, which he munched on rather greatfully and then I carried him down away from all the parked vehicles and turned him loose near some rocks and bushes. That is the last time I saw one.

[Barry 0]

You just have to be in the right place at the right time. April and May in Johnson Valley they are easy to spot. They are out in the valleys, not in the washes. Out tying ribbon for our National H&H in April I've seen several in one day.

[Kevin 0]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one :heat:

[dirt dame 561]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one :heat:

I'll bet you don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny either :heat:

[Kevin 0]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one :heat:

I'll bet you don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny either :heat:

Dont forget about the tooth ferry!

[dirt dame 561]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one

I'll bet you don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny either :heat:

Dont forget about the tooth ferry!

The tooth ferry? Is that some kind of a boat the tooth fairy uses to come and get your teeth when you accidently get them knocked out on your crossbar :heat: ?

[Kevin 0]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one

I'll bet you don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny either :heat:

Dont forget about the tooth ferry!

The tooth ferry? Is that some kind of a boat the tooth fairy uses to come and get your teeth when you accidently get them knocked out on your crossbar :heat: ?

So you have seen it!

[Metal Twister 0]

I think the turtle might be a myth as I have never seen one :heat:

If my good friends on this forum have seen them, then by all means they do exist! So who saw the Tooth

Ferry?

[dirt dame 561]

:heat: Hmmm, obviously nobody here but myself knows the glorious tradition of the tooth fairy coming to your house at night (in his boat) and finding and taking your tooth from under your pillow while you are sleeping, AND replacing it with....a California desert tortoise! :heat:

[Metal Twister 0]

:heat: Hmmm, obviously nobody here but myself knows the glorious tradition of the tooth fairy coming to your house at night (in his boat) and finding and taking your tooth from under your pillow while you are sleeping, AND replacing it with....a California desert tortoise! :heat:

I feel a little bummed, all I ever got was was money. YOUR SO LUCKY !!!!

We can blame this on the heat, right?

[dirt dame 561]

:heat: Hmmm, obviously nobody here but myself knows the glorious tradition of the tooth fairy coming to your house at night (in his boat) and finding and taking your tooth from under your pillow while you are sleeping, AND replacing it with....a California desert tortoise!

I feel a little bummed, all I ever got was was money. YOUR SO LUCKY !!!!

We can blame this on the heat, right?

Yup :heat: It's about 107 degrees up here at my house and it sure is driving me crazy!

[Metal Twister 0]

:heat: Hmmm, obviously nobody here but myself knows the glorious tradition of the tooth fairy coming to your house at night (in his boat) and finding and taking your tooth from under your pillow while you are sleeping, AND replacing it with....a California desert tortoise!

I feel a little bummed, all I ever got was was money. YOUR SO LUCKY !!!!

We can blame this on the heat, right?

Yup :heat: It's about 107 degrees up here at my house and it sure is driving me crazy!

Maybe its time to hit the mall and its AC.

[Barry 0]

Twenty years of riding in Ocotillo Wells I've never seen a desert tortoise. I've seen many in Johnson Valley. A good friend of ours has 4 as pets. I call the largest one Stewie, and keep telling her, one of these days I'm going to make stew out of him. This spring, tying ribbon for our National, I found a nice turtle shell about the size of Stewie. I was going to take the shell home and put it at her front door with a note on how good Stewie tasted. The shell stunk so bad I couldn't haul it back to camp.

[Barry 0]

Twenty years of riding in Ocotillo Wells I've never seen a desert tortoise. I've seen many in Johnson Valley. A good friend of ours has 4 as pets. I call the largest one Stewie, and keep telling her, one of these days I'm going to make stew out of him. This spring, tying ribbon for our National, I found a nice turtle shell about the size of Stewie. I was going to take the shell home and put it at her front door with a note on how good Stewie tasted. The shell stunk so bad I couldn't haul it back to camp.

One of the members PM'd me about the above quote. They were concerned that an environmentalist would see it and try to find my friend. This is my response to him.

It is illegal to take one from the wild home as a pet. It is not illegal to have them as pets. You could get one from a friend or neighbor. Several years ago there was an article in the Desert Sun newspaper about the over abundance of eggs from pet tortoises. The head of the Living Desert was telling everyone with pets to destroy the tortoise eggs because we would become over run with turtles. Hard to believe isn't it. An environmentalist telling everyone to destroy the desert tortoise. If all the pet desert tortoises were counted as part of the population, the tortoise would probably be removed from the endangered species list. Can't have that!

The turtle as a species does not die from old age. They live forever. They die from disease or injury. The desert tortoise has had a respitory disease for years. Instead of the environmentalists finding a cure they choose to close the land down. They don't give a rat’s ass about the desert tortoise, only the land it is on, or could be on.

According to environmentalists, to take the tortoise off the endangered species list there would have to be 2.5 turtles per acre. When you include the land that is part of the act that turtles were never on in the first place you are up against a brick wall. Environmentalist have no idea how many turtles there were per acre, 2.5 is a guess.

THIS PART IS NEW AND MY OPINION

The Endangered Species Act is a money maker for environmentatlist. When they take the BLM to court the BLM succumbs to the environmentalists wishes. The BLM never puts up a fight. Part of the Act is the environmentalists get their legal fees back. There have been instances where the environmentalists have spent thousands and tried to get millions back. THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT HAS TO BE REWRITTEN.

Barry

[Kevin 0]

. THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT HAS TO BE REWRITTEN.

Barry

I will 2nd that!

[Metal Twister 0]

THIS PART IS NEW AND MY OPINION

The Endangered Species Act is a money maker for environmentatlist. When they take the BLM to court the BLM succumbs to the environmentalists wishes. The BLM never puts up a fight. Part of the Act is the environmentalists get their legal fees back. There have been instances where the environmentalists have spent thousands and tried to get millions back. THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT HAS TO BE REWRITTEN.

Barry

Thanks Barry! Boy I bet the environmentalists hate it when the truth comes out! Thanks for posting this I learned something here tonight. It's funny how everyone here that has encountered a desert turtle has taken it in, cared for it, and then set it free in a safer location. I get so sick of the environmentalists assuming that we aren't just because we ride Dual Sports.

[dirt dame 561]

Don't get me started about environmentalists. I had seen many articles in my AMA magazines about how large mining companies could go in and destroy or move all the tortoises they wanted to back in the 80s if they had enough money to feed the environmentalists. I have read documentation on other unsavory activities they are involved in, not in the name of good stewardship of the land, but just $$$$$

[Kevin 0]

The desert Tortoise has another problem in that it will not drink water. It hydrates itself only though the vegitation it eats. This turtle lives in the desert-no vegitation means no water!

Why dont we all just move the turtles to a nice Oasis somewhere with all the vegitation to eat/drink, this way the turtle will prospere, and then we can have our land back. Closing down the whole state is not the correct/viable approach to saving an endagered species. I will pay for the U-Haul!

[dirt dame 561]

I'll chip in for a U-haul, if somebody would just please haul the so-called environmentalist off somewhere.

[Joliet 0]

After seeing this post I talked to an old-timer friend of mine and asked him how many tortoises he had seen in the desert. He said, "live only a few, but if you find a ravens nest you can sometimes find dozens of shells under it."

Here is some info I found on desertusa.com.

Curious Facts

The Desert Tortoise is able to live where ground temperature may exceed 140 degrees F.

95% of a Desert Tortoise’s life is spent in underground burrows

Ravens have caused more than 50 percent of juvenile Desert Tortoise deaths in some areas of the Mojave Desert.

Adult tortoises may survive a year or more without access to water.

Desert Tortoise populations have declined by 90 percent since the 1980s

Ravens are now one of the Desert turtle’s primary predators.

Much of the tortoise’s water intake comes from moisture in the grasses and wildflowers they consume in the spring.

It is unlawful to touch, harm, harass or collect a wild Desert Tortoise

This is from www.werc.usgs.gov

"Boarman studies ravens in the Mojave Desert where over the last 30 years their numbers have risen by more than 1,000 percent, subsidized by human populations that have expanded into the desert. His raven research relates to the federally-threatened desert tortoise and management questions regarding how to prevent hungry ravens from decimating young tortoises."

Here is another good article on the Tortoise.

http://www.nwf.org/nationalwildlife/articl...p;articleID=201

And I think the ravens are protected to. I think pretty much everything is protected except the right to ride where we want. Ken

[SCHWINN 0]

I once saw a snipe, jackalope and bike sluts double breasted bikini bird ,and 1 liger but no turtles, oh yea, did I mention nitrous was in camp loose.

[sandiegoland 0]

The turtle as a species does not die from old age. They live forever. They die from disease or injury. The desert tortoise has had a respitory disease for years.

They don't live forever. 80 - 100 years, but here's an article that substantiates the use of the tortoise for food (before their protection). It also mentions the respiratory issues.

A NATURAL HISTORY OF THE DESERT TORTOISE, Gopherus [Xerobates] agassizii

I was talking to a local Historian the other day when he mentioned something that really peaked my interest. He made commit that both the Native American, and Early Settlers would collect the turtles up as they crossed the desert. They were easy to keep alive for long periods of time. Thus they could have a fresh meal when ever they wanted one. He claims that the southern deserts were hunted to extinction with a few still around in the central and northern upper desert.

Also as Joliet mentioned, another more recent threat is the raven encroachment (due to urban and garbage dump expansion).

[ADV Bum 205]

here's an article that substantiates the use of the tortoise for food

A NATURAL HISTORY OF THE DESERT TORTOISE, Gopherus [Xerobates] agassizii

Also as Joliet mentioned, another more recent threat is the raven encroachment (due to urban and garbage dump expansion).

Turtle soup, and black bird pie. MMMM Gooood!!