Frustration with my TE450

[DesmoStucky 0]

I can hear a distinct rattling, clicking when I am very slowly decelerating. I checked my valves and they are all pretty much perfect. Could my timing chain really be stretched out at less than 8k on the clock. The bike has an auto-tension-er so I would not suspect that to be broken. I have been dumping too much time and money into this bike. I have definitely spent more time in the garage than riding. Anyone have any advice? I have an appointment at GP this Friday, so if I can't get it figured out by then they will take care of it. Thanks ya'll.

-Mike

[dirt dame 561]

Sorry that you are having a bad time with your TE. Couldn't be able to guess at what the noise might be without actually hearing it. Are you actually having new problems popping up while you are using the bike, or are you trying to fix things that were wrong with it left over from the previous owner?

[DesmoStucky 0]

Well since I bought it I have only put on about 200 miles. I then did a complete service with all new fluids and valve check. Shortly after I started hearing the rattling. I rechecked the valves this morning and changed both the intake shims (they were a little tight), went for a ride, and I am still hearing the clicking.

I can't really say I have caused the problem, because I have not had the chance to really ride the bike. My first 100 miles were worry free though.

[Sneeker 29]

I can hear a distinct rattling, clicking when I am very slowly decelerating. I checked my valves and they are all pretty much perfect. Could my timing chain really be stretched out at less than 8k on the clock. The bike has an auto-tension-er so I would not suspect that to be broken. I have been dumping too much time and money into this bike. I have definitely spent more time in the garage than riding. Anyone have any advice? I have an appointment at GP this Friday, so if I can't get it figured out by then they will take care of it. Thanks ya'll.

-Mike

Read this thread at Husky Cafe, let us know if you think this could be it.

http://www.cafehusky.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7653

Mimi, this is what I had in mind when I said a while ago that the auto cam chain tensioner doesn't always work perfectly on the newer Husky 4-strokes.

[kellymac530 0]

sneeker sounds like you have hit the nail on the head.

i know it is NO husky...but...on my ktm...he newer Xc4 motors had a similar problem. they are purely a hydraulic tensioner, only using the engine oil pressure to keep pressure on the timing chain.

When you sit at idle or real low rpms the engine oil pressure {or if you ever run it low on oil} is too low to keep enough pressure on the chain. so you got a horrible clatter from the chain slap.

Dirt Tricks makes a direct tensioner replacement for the KTM for about 80 bucks. it only takes 5 minutes to replace it and it solves the problem on the KTM. what it does is it has a small preload spring in front of the hydraulic tensioner so even at low engine rpm there is some tension on the

T-chain.

It looked like someone posted a similar type of part for the husky.

I hope this is all it is Desmo, it is very common on the ktm, and sounds like it is fairly common on the Varna as well.

[DesmoStucky 0]

I am heading downstairs to remove my tensioner. My issue sounds very similar, but I don't have any noise at idle, hard accel, or hard decel. Only when holding near constant throttle with a very slight decel. Anyway, I really appreciate all the help and advice! Fingers crossed...

-Mike

[kellymac530 0]

it very well may be the tensioner. When you hard on the thottle and then chop it off oil pressure can drop which may have a similar affect...

try the screw driver stethoscope thing if you can replicate the noise while it is on the stand.

auto parts stores sell actual mechanics stethoscopes fairly cheaply...very helpful for rattles and knock location

[dirt dame 561]

Husqvarna doesn't have a hydraulic tensioner. It should be a one way auto adjuster with little teeth that ratchet out driven by spring tension. I hear that the little teeth sometime get worn and slip from engine vibration.

[kellymac530 0]

i guess my point was less about the hydraulic part...than the timing chain tensioner slapping with the chain and causing a rattle...sorry for the confusion on my part...

so is the system kinda like the ktm RFS motor?

[DesmoStucky 0]

Well I am not 100% certain it is the tensioner, but it is definitely the leading suspect now. I could not use the stethoscope method, because I can not replicate the rattle at idle, or without a load. This causes a problem for all of the other tests as well. Anyway, I removed the tensioner, and for the most part it looks good. I think there is one tooth that might be a bit worn down. Removing the spring and running the engine does not cause the pusher arm to back out. So it passes that particular test.

However, if you look at the picture below, looking in the motor you can see that there is some rubber covering what the tensioner pushes against (name?). This rubber like coating has torn. I'm not really sure if this is something that needs to be replaced or not. Perhaps it is the tensioner pusher (again name?) hitting that metal plate which is causing the noise. I think I will replace the tensioner, and perhaps look into that coated plate thing (I really wish I knew what that thing is called ). Thanks again for the suggestions!

-Mike

These pictures don't really show a whole lot, but are included for thoroughness .

[Spaugh 1]

the tensioner is extended pretty far there.

you need to put the tensioner back on the bike but first take the main screw out and push the pusher back in. Don't put the main screw back in until the unit is mounted. Then put the main screw in so that it ratchets itself back to the correct setting.

Then take the main screw out again and finally take the whole unit off with the main screw already out if you want to see how stretched your chain is. That is the only way to get a good reading. hope it made sense.

[dirt dame 561]

It' the slipper (there is a front one too), and it goes down the engine and into the bottom by the crank. It does look like the slipper needs to be replaced, but how it got worn all goofy like that is a mystery. If the slipper were too thin, it would cause your tensioner to go all the way out maybe.

[DesmoStucky 0]

the tensioner is extended pretty far there.

you need to put the tensioner back on the bike but first take the main screw out and push the pusher back in. Don't put the main screw back in until the unit is mounted. Then put the main screw in so that it ratchets itself back to the correct setting.

Then take the main screw out again and finally take the whole unit off with the main screw already out if you want to see how stretched your chain is. That is the only way to get a good reading. hope it made sense.

I extended the tensioner just for the picture. I put it back on the bike to take the spring out. Followed your steps above exactly. Sorry for the misleading photo.

-Mike

[DesmoStucky 0]

It' the slipper (there is a front one too), and it goes down the engine and into the bottom by the crank. It does look like the slipper needs to be replaced, but how it got worn all goofy like that is a mystery. If the slipper were too thin, it would cause your tensioner to go all the way out maybe.

Just want to make it clear that the tensioner is not even extended through half it's length when inserted and pushed up against the slipper (thanks Mimi).

-Mike

[Spaugh 1]

the tensioner is extended pretty far there.

you need to put the tensioner back on the bike but first take the main screw out and push the pusher back in. Don't put the main screw back in until the unit is mounted. Then put the main screw in so that it ratchets itself back to the correct setting.

Then take the main screw out again and finally take the whole unit off with the main screw already out if you want to see how stretched your chain is. That is the only way to get a good reading. hope it made sense.

I extended the tensioner just for the picture. I put it back on the bike to take the spring out. Followed your steps above exactly. Sorry for the misleading photo.

-Mike

if you did all that and it came off not fully extended you are in good shape. The bad news is you might need to take the cam cover and break the chain to get the new part in there. The tensioner looks identical to the old ktm unit. But the part that is pushes on that hits the chain is plastic in the ktm. Maybe someone makes a non coated plastic one aftermarket. good luck.

[starpal2 0]

open the valve cover and take a look around. follow the chain down with a flash light and maybe even take the guides out and look them over. another possible noise could be chain slap as it is only when in motion. check around the bike for anything loose before you dive into the engine.

[DesmoStucky 0]

Good advice. I have already lubed the chain, checked the kickstand, and looked over most of the bolts. I am almost certain it is internal. Thanks for the reminder though; I'll have to double check everything again.

-Mike

[Joliet 0]

Mike, after the stock (drive) chain guide got bent on my 510, it made a heck of a racket (even though it looked good), I replaced it with a BRP and it has been fine since. It was a pain figuring out where all the noise was coming from.

I would check my screens, filter and magnetic plug, if there is nothing showing, that would give me confidence in the motor.

If you do end up pulling the head, I would consider installing thicker gaskets to lower the compression a little.

Also, I don't know what year bike this is, think about adding the bike to your signature line. Good luck, Ken

[dirt dame 561]

Good advice. I have already lubed the chain, checked the kickstand, and looked over most of the bolts.

While you are at it, next time you have to adjust the drive chain or replace a rear tire, or even if you just have some spare time on your hands....be sure to pull the chain adjuster bolts out and put some anti-seize compound on the threads. I went three years without having the bolts freeze up, but then just recently had to tap and insert the swingarm after the right side one froze up and then snapped off. It is nasty business trying to get into that little awkward area to get the old bolt drilled out etc.

[DesmoStucky 0]

I will definitely take a closer look at my drive chain after your comments Joliet. Thanks.

My next step will be to drain the oil. I'll look at the screens, the magnetic plug, as well as check the oil in the sun to see if I can see any shimmering flakes. The oil is brand new, but this test is necessary. Fingers crosses for no shiny stuff.

After Dirt Dame's advice, I will probably go ahead and tear apart the rear swing arm, put on the anti-seize as well as put new grease in the rear suspension links. After all of this work, hopefully the bike runs like a top. Honestly though, I can't see myself keeping it. I can't sell the bike with a clear conscious after the things I have discovered. However, if I fix it all up I am sure it will be a very nice bike for someone. They shouldn't have to do major maintenance for a long time.

All of this work, and I never get the opportunity to ride. The thing I miss about street bikes is being able to cruise out to 94 for a fun ride which only took 1 to 2 hours. It seems like any dirt rides I want to do are an all day affair. Maybe I'm just frustrated though...

[kellymac530 0]

i say....do a nice service on it, look for any damage signs, I.E. metal shavings or signs of some failure....then ride the thing like you stole it...screw it man...if it blows it blows...get past all of this ds stress, it shouldn't be like that...i check my oil and ride.....lube my x-ring chain every other ride {after a ride}, clean my filter everytime it looks dirty {pop off side cover and look} change oil every 1000-1500 miles...and i ride the wheels off of it...

if all else fails....adjust your schenictetor valve, rotate your muffler bearings, and finagle your flux anticipator.....that will fix it....

ride it desmo ride it...but im not paying to fix it....just have fun on it

if you are not comfortable riding it, and you are not comfortable selling it with something wrong with it in good conscience...you could donate it to me...i will make sure it gets taken good care of

[DesmoStucky 0]

i say....do a nice service on it, look for any damage signs, I.E. metal shavings or signs of some failure....then ride the thing like you stole it...screw it man...if it blows it blows...get past all of this ds stress, it shouldn't be like that...i check my oil and ride.....lube my x-ring chain every other ride {after a ride}, clean my filter everytime it looks dirty {pop off side cover and look} change oil every 1000-1500 miles...and i ride the wheels off of it...

if all else fails....adjust your schenictetor valve, rotate your muffler bearings, and finagle your flux anticipator.....that will fix it....

ride it desmo ride it...but im not paying to fix it....just have fun on it

Haha, point taken.

[kellymac530 0]

if you are not comfortable riding it...and not comfortable selling it in good conscience with a potential issue.... you could DONATE it to me...i will make sure it gets taken GOOD care of

[dirt dame 561]

After all of this work, hopefully the bike runs like a top. Honestly though, I can't see myself keeping it. I can't sell the bike with a clear conscious after the things I have discovered. However, if I fix it all up I am sure it will be a very nice bike for someone. They shouldn't have to do major maintenance for a long time.

All of this work, and I never get the opportunity to ride.

Sounds like you inherited somebody else's problems. These TEs really are great reliable machines. I have over 6000 miles on mine and still haven't had to do one valve adjustment. I've heard of these bikes going 9000-10,000 miles before a valve even goes out of adjustment. I do an oil change every 500 miles and a filter change every 1000 miles. I haven't come across one major issue except for a starter motor issue back in the first 4 months of ownership. Heck, my OEM battery is still good and the drive chain finally wore enough to replace the sprockets and chain at 6000 miles. I trust the bike to get me out to the trails and back again day in and day out. It's about as trouble free as any Japanese bike.

[starpal2 0]

also another thought came to mind possibly something with your clutch perhaps? should be easy to take a look. oh and when you drain the oil keep an eye out for ground up rubber/plastic possibly from the cam chain guides as i have had this happen to me on another bike...