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Suspension

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I think that suspension and tires are the two most important things in regards to safety on a dirt bike... yeah; there is always the other things we spend money on, and can consider discretionary...

new plastics

stickers

fancy levers

edge lights

anondized wheels

but I've always considered "where the rubber meets the road " (or in this case dirt) as the most important thing... I rode with walker1 twice before his little incident... both times I BUSTED his chops about Death Wings... get some knobbies!

Now... what keeps the "rubber on the dirt"? That's right : suspension... probably the best money you can spend on a bike... I can spend $1000 on new suspension, or $600 on a new carb, and $500 or so on a big bore... that $1000 is the only money that will make my bike faster, yet safer

Other opinions? if so; start your own thread; I'm looking for validation here...

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And don't forget the loud pipe, the suspension will do you no good if you are dead???? I guess I will start my own thread. <_< Ken

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yeah those tires ain't much for traction....

even checking a little side "road" this morning i was squirrely...ugh

may be seeing what i can pull for XMAS suspension wise...

and, now rightfully paranoid(*doesn't mean they aren't watching you...) about those deathwings.....

leading to...thread asking about best all around tire, dual sport wise....for SD coming soon.....

thank you for the logic Bikeslut...it DOES make sense....

Blind <_<

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And don't forget the loud pipe, the suspension will do you no good if you are dead???? I guess I will start my own thread. <_< Ken

a loud pipe on a dirt bike is the biggest waste of money I can imagine...

if your bike REALLY does not make enough power, I'd be surprised... when I rode with FN the other day, I was probably full throttle 5 times all day... and he pulled away from me like I was standing still... but the BEST power increase would come from jetting, a new carb, stroke it/bore it, airbox mods, header mods, etc. The pipe is a good option after you've done the rest, and I predict you won't be able to find a pipe over 96db after a few years.

The juvenile delinquent in me really likes the sound of a loud pipe... on my OWN bike; i don't really want to hear anybody elses. (I have stock pipes on all of my bikes now)

anybody care to chime in that has had suspension work done? I have ridden bikes with GREAT suspension, and it makes a huge difference...

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And don't forget the loud pipe, the suspension will do you no good if you are dead???? I guess I will start my own thread. :ph34r: Ken

a loud pipe on a dirt bike is the biggest waste of money I can imagine...

ANY

anybody care to chime in that has had suspension work done? I have ridden bikes with GREAT suspension, and it makes a huge difference...

I had the suspension done on my DRZ by Rudy. I upgraded to cartridge forks and put in springs for my weight and had Rudy set them up. It was better, but I could not recommend it for a rider as slow as I am, or a bike as heavy as the DRZ. I just don't ride hard enough to see $1000 difference between the old forks and the new ones.

Personally I would have to recommend springing for the correct riding weight, set the sag correctly, and if needed change the weight of the oil or revalve. If still not satisfied, then go with the big buck suspension tune. These things you can do yourself with a manual, or get the help of someone that has done it before.

:D Ken

PS. Loud bikes are like a cancer to our sport. I was looking for the "I am being facetious" icon, but couldn't find it, obviously the question marks didn't make my point.

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I know there are those on the site who don't like Precision Concepts in El Cajon but (so far) I do. I can tell you that riding this bike with their suspension is sooooo much better than the stock bikes I've ridden. There are whoops that would've tossed me with the stock suspension. To me that makes it a safety issue. Anything that saves my ass from crashing makes my riding safer.

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As far as XRs go, nobody knows them better than Precision Concepts. Even Honda uses them for their race team bikes. I've never given them business or talked to anybody there so I have no opinion. Although Chief Gunner sunk a bit of money into his XR and his bike rides worlds better than mine did (I think he sent his stuff to PC). On his bike, bumps or ridges that would've sent my bike into the air, his was not only firmly planted on the ground but a few of them I didn't even notice or I noticed them because I wanted to get some air and couldn't. Sounds like it'd be much safer to me.

Bob, springs'll run ya a few hundred maybe some seals and a handful of Valves. Find somebody that'll coach you through it all in their garage and throw them a few bills and you could probably have the suspenders done for around $500.

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As far as XRs go, nobody knows them better than Precision Concepts. Even Honda uses them for their race team bikes. I've never given them business or talked to anybody there so I have no opinion. Although Chief Gunner sunk a bit of money into his XR and his bike rides worlds better than mine did (I think he sent his stuff to PC). On his bike, bumps or ridges that would've sent my bike into the air, his was not only firmly planted on the ground but a few of them I didn't even notice or I noticed them because I wanted to get some air and couldn't. Sounds like it'd be much safer to me.

Bob, springs'll run ya a few hundred maybe some seals and a handful of Valves. Find somebody that'll coach you through it all in their garage and throw them a few bills and you could probably have the suspenders done for around $500.

I costed out the springs, and it was just over $100 for each fork leg, and the rear as well... My sag is actually not that far off, but I'm sure my weight is too much for those springs... I actually got rid of my DR350 beacuse, as much as I liked the bike, I couldn't get the suspension dialed for my weight and lack of riding style. The DRZ was worlds better at first (although I liked the DR power delivery right off idle better), but due to wear, or something else, it doesn't seem to work as well... for the forks, i should probably start with a fluid replacement, and maybe heavier weight, and see if that cures it...

but the original reason for the post was: suspension is one of the best ways to improve your speed AND make the ride safer... tires being the other... both are good investments, and nobody ever says I wish my tires didn't stick so well, or I wish my suspension wasn't quite so good.

People DO say that about power and brakes... suspension is a great way to spend money... if'n you have it.

I have to say... radios and SPOT are two other safety measures.... a radio is probably next on my list... I feel like a parasite using FNs radio all the time... at some point, I'll buy one. they really do make the ride more enjoyable, and safer. Rides move at a better pace, because there is no "group meetings" to decide "what next"... I was able to radio Paul "rider down" (If he wasn't radioing me the same thing he would've heard me) which would make a huge difference if I was hurt.

And really... what can you say about SPOT- riding alone, it may be the ONLY thing that will save your life... I will be getting a unit MUCH like this in the future... The unit I am looking at IS the SPOT... only mine will be paid for and carried by fake name, dig dug or christie... effective AND cost effective for me

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My Trailwings 301/302s don't seem as bad as the death wings when looking at them at least on blind's DRZ, that being said I have wondered about suspension a lot.

As Ken says I wonder at my skill level and weight if it would matter, I do hear from many other people that my bike needs some work especially in the rear, I think it rebounds too quick and wants to pitch forward on whoops

I think tires/suspension are definitely good things to invest in along with anything safety related. (like the radio and spot. I am still a little skeptical on the spot thing as the radio with the HAM license should let you get a message out unless you were unconcious.)

I'm going to be going up to LA and hitting Gorman/Hungry Valley on the 8th which should be interesting since I have ridden there a few times before on my other bike and will let me feel out the new bike more.

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As Ken says I wonder at my skill level and weight if it would matter, I do hear from many other people that my bike needs some work especially in the rear, I think it rebounds too quick and wants to pitch forward on whoops

Start sorting out your suspension by figuring out what rate spring is the proper one for your weight. Then make sure you have the proper sag set on the proper spring rate. This is very important that you have these two matched correctly. Then adjust your valving settings. Then if you are still having problems, you can have the valve shims restacked.

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I think that suspension and tires are the two most important things in regards to safety on a dirt bike...

I'd say safety starts with training/knowledge.....doesn't matter how good the suspension/tires are if the rider is clueless as to how to utilize suspension settings, tire pressure, etc.

Was I supposed to start my own thread if I disagree? :ph34r::D:D:D:D

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I think that suspension and tires are the two most important things in regards to safety on a dirt bike...

I'd say safety starts with training/knowledge.....doesn't matter how good the suspension/tires are if the rider is clueless as to how to utilize suspension settings, tire pressure, etc.

Was I supposed to start my own thread if I disagree? :ph34r::D:D:D:D

thems the rulz

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I think that suspension and tires are the two most important things in regards to safety on a dirt bike... yeah; there is always the other things we spend money on, and can consider discretionary...

I have to agree :D .... Otherwise.... I, my leg, would look even dumber.... :D

but I've always considered "where the rubber meets the road " (or in this case dirt) as the most important thing... I rode with walker1 twice before his little incident... both times I BUSTED his chops about Death Wings... get some knobbies!

yes bs did bust my.....chops.... :D Although it, the bust, felt alot lower at the time....

I tend to do things backwards.. must be that mentally challenged thing I've been going through!!

Other opinions? if so; start your own thread; I'm looking for validation here...

I have to admit I was pushing the envelope of safety and it POPPED... :D

I DID NOT :D ... set up the suspension for my weight.. and I was lax on tires..

Mike at Full Throttle had my new tires wating for me..

I Just Wanted To Ride :ph34r: .....Ride :D ....Ride :D ....

So Take Heed!

SUSPENSION......TIRES.......THESE BOOTS!!!

post-2790-1225326506_thumb.jpg

AND A RED THONG ( just in case they have to cut your pants off....)

right bs?

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As Ken says I wonder at my skill level and weight if it would matter, I do hear from many other people that my bike needs some work especially in the rear, I think it rebounds too quick and wants to pitch forward on whoops

Start sorting out your suspension by figuring out what rate spring is the proper one for your weight. Then make sure you have the proper sag set on the proper spring rate. This is very important that you have these two matched correctly. Then adjust your valving settings. Then if you are still having problems, you can have the valve shims restacked.

I am a light weight so I don't think I could need a stiffer spring but I do want to figure out the sag setting thing. I know it theoretically just never have done it in practice.

I think that suspension and tires are the two most important things in regards to safety on a dirt bike...

I'd say safety starts with training/knowledge.....doesn't matter how good the suspension/tires are if the rider is clueless as to how to utilize suspension settings, tire pressure, etc.

Was I supposed to start my own thread if I disagree? :ph34r::D:D:D:D

I know tire pressure but how many people know what clicking up their compression or rebound actually does and can "fix" problems? Thats why people send it to the pros IMO. Safety and knowledge is always worth an investment, any investment in the ability of the rider almost always outweighs one in the vehicle or any type.

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Start sorting out your suspension by figuring out what rate spring is the proper one for your weight. Then make sure you have the proper sag set on the proper spring rate. This is very important that you have these two matched correctly. Then adjust your valving settings. Then if you are still having problems, you can have the valve shims restacked.

I am a light weight so I don't think I could need a stiffer spring but I do want to figure out the sag setting thing. I know it theoretically just never have done it in practice.

You may need a lighter spring.

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Suspension is definitly number one in my book for being able to control your bike and it being able to absorb the obsticles that we dirt bikers tend to like to go over. I would also rate a steering stabilizer up towards the top. :ph34r:

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Suspension is definitly number one in my book for being able to control your bike and it being able to absorb the obsticles that we dirt bikers tend to like to go over. I would also rate a steering stabilizer up towards the top. :blink:

I agree with all the past statements that properly sized springs, sag, valving to suit the rider is important, but many do not have the time, knowledge or the will to learn to troubleshoot suspension. Typically the factory rider spends weeks with a team of Engineers testing a myriad of different suspension setups. But the best design is a concept until it has proven itself (through testing) on the track. Given the vast number of performance variables & the diversity of tasks that modern suspension must handle, finding the optimum setup can be a daunting task. It is precisely this task, however, that provides the greatest advantage to the factory rider(and lot's of skill).

While there may be a modicum of exotic material used to build "works" suspension components(which unless is not necessary until you are a pro-level racer), the real cost lies in the R & D man-hours invested in testing countless setup configurations.

A consequence of this individualized approach is the fact that while this bike may work perfectly for the intended rider, while others may find it lacking, if not flat-out bizarre. How often have we heard a magazine editor remark, when test-riding the factory star's bike, that the ride was "strange," and that while they thought the forks were "too stiff" or the rear-end "too low," that "it must work for Ricky." Indeed, what works for you, or for Ricky, won't work for Joe, as we all ride on different terrain with an individually unique riding style.

That is why many (even the casual rider) work with local suspension tuners(no this isn't an endorsement).

How many people will admit to never changing the clickers? More than most, but many will not admit.

Also often overlooked is ergonomically fitted components (to your bike) and your unique riding style and body-type. Footpegs, seat, bar position (risers), bars and levers fitted correctly and comfortably can make a huge difference.

Many of these modifications are inexpensive, easy to install and if they don't work you can usually re-sell on eBay.

Finally I seen plenty of riders never, never change grips. They are worn down to the bar, sliced or have no grip on the grip??? Changing grips is possibly the cheapest upgrade that's often overlooked. No it will not make you ride faster/better, but it may slightly provide less fatigue and safety.

Ever look at a used bike with worn grips? Kind of tells the maintenance or attention to detail story. :ph34r:

OK enough with the sermon, let's ride(even with stock grips)

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To set your sag bounce your bike up and down a few times and measure from your axle nut to a point on the rear frame (behind the seat). With all your gear on get on the bike and bounce up and down again. Remain on your bike, put a hand against a wall for balance. Have someone measure from the same two points again. The difference between these two measurements should be 100mm or 4 inches. Adjust your spring tension accordingly.

To tell if you have the right spring bounce your bike up and down a few times and measure from your axle nut to a point on the rear frame (behind the seat) again. This is a new measurement. Put your bike on a stand and with the rear wheel off the ground measure again. The difference between these two measurements should be 25mm or 1 inch. If this measurement is greater than 1 inch you need a heavier spring, if less you need a lighter spring.

To adjust your rebound find yourself a good set of whoops. Progressively ride faster and faster through them. If you feel like your suspension is getting hard it is packing up on you. You need more rebound. If the rear is bouncing from side to side you have too much rebound. When the rear wheel is off the ground the shock is returning too fast making the bike kick from side to side. You want to be able to ride through the whoops straight as an arrow.

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information junction here!!!!

man i got thing to work on...... :blink:

reviewing this thread i see i might be best served by working on my bike on Sat than actually

potentially "walker"ing myself(*with all due respect.. :blink: )....with the deathwings, and no changes to the suspension....

Blind :lol: has WAY more than 4" travel...oh crap!!! :ph34r:

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information junction here!!!!

man i got thing to work on...... :blink:

reviewing this thread i see i might be best served by working on my bike on Sat than actually

potentially "walker"ing myself(*with all due respect.. :blink: )....with the deathwings, and no changes to the suspension....

Blind :lol: has WAY more than 4" travel...oh crap!!! :ph34r:

If money is an issue, I have a rear knobbie you can have... brand new... nothing you would want to ride on the street, but a good soft conditions tire...

I don't have anything for the front...

I'll send you some info on suspension set up, but springs are definitely needed if you are as heavy as you imply... I am 220 and need them, too. I bottom out WAY to often...

on thumpertalk, there is also a spring size worksheet, and you can get lots of info from them...

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yeah those tires ain't much for traction....

even checking a little side "road" this morning i was squirrely...ugh

may be seeing what i can pull for XMAS suspension wise...

and, now rightfully paranoid(*doesn't mean they aren't watching you...) about those deathwings.....

leading to...thread asking about best all around tire, dual sport wise....for SD coming soon.....

thank you for the logic Bikeslut...it DOES make sense....

Blind :lol:

Blind

There is lots of good advice here but do yourself a favor. Before you spend a lot of money trying to customize your bike remember that it was designed by some pretty sharp people with a lot of resources. You would do well to spend a lot of time in the desert practicing with your stock setup developing your skills to meet the potential of the bike first. Only when you feel limited by your superior skills and riding interests should you customize a bike to fit those needs. Professional racers have very special needs, but is that what you need? I suspect your bike was well designed and if you read your manual on how to adjust it to fit you unique riding needs you will find it can do a great deal without expensive custom modifications. I have been riding the same Husqvarna dirt bikes for over 30 years and have not needed to make any modifications that the bikes were not designed to make. I think if you learn how to ride your bike as it is first then you will be in a position to see its limitations. Most off road riding is about 10% bike design and 90% rider's skills. I have seen a very good rider (my brother-a professional racer for Suzuki) riding a Suzuki 185 run circles around a novice on a Honda CR500. Work on your skills first then make changes to the bike when they really are necessary for what you want to do.

Don

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Work on your skills first

Right.....Agreed....and hey, that sounds familiar :lol::lol:

I'd say safety starts with training/knowledge.....doesn't matter how good the suspension/tires are if the rider is clueless as to how to utilize suspension settings, tire pressure, etc.

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Work on your skills first

Right.....Agreed....and hey, that sounds familiar :lol::lol:

I'd say safety starts with training/knowledge.....doesn't matter how good the suspension/tires are if the rider is clueless as to how to utilize suspension settings, tire pressure, etc.

You inspired me to speak up Chris. :lol:

Did you see my latest photo on the West Fest?

Don

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Zenosan and Crawdaddy....et al....:friends:

believe me when i say this.... THANK YOU. it reinforces what i have been thinking about in regards to my suspension....because truthfully i don't think i need any "specialized" suspension changes as it is now.

i planned on riding this bike as a "learning" experience...see what it is when i get it, tweak it a little when i notice something i don't like about it.....and as i read(*reread) this thread, and researched the whole thing, i began to realize what i need to do is get new tires FIRST, and make a little "adjustments" to the suspension...

i AGREE COMPLETELY i need to work on MY SKILLS(*truthfully) on ALL bike techniques...truer words never been spoken...and as i do work on those "skills" i think there's where i will see what things need adjusting...

and now all that being said, i got authorization from the CFO of the family for tires so that is my Sat. plan, change the tires...and a little tweaking on the adjusters i already got!!!

THANKS AGAIN for the reassurance!!!

Blind B)

speaking of all of this "skill stuff"....carguy --you back from IR?? is there plans for dirt bike classes? you know safety ...it's job 1(*trademark infringement be damned!!!)

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